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Information on the Lenin statue shown in this albums cover.
Lenin Wiki Link
On related Seattle news, the Freemont Troll is moving to Bellevue. Maybe 10 years ago I would have cared more, though over the last several years especially I've stopped thinking of myself as a Seattle-ite and more a Pacific-Northwesterner.
LLRP
Lenin Wiki Link
Read the 2020 Census and learn how it was working out: https://www.census.gov/content...
"[In 2019,] the Black poverty rate was the lowest since 1959, the first year for which poverty estimates were published."
"The 2019 Hispanic poverty rate of 15.7 percent reflects the lowest poverty rate for this population since estimates were first produced in 1972."
The lowest poverty rates in 50 years? Time to "fix" that!
Ya...Primary sources can be a bitch.
You do realize the US Census is a political instrument, don't you? It was established in the Constitution as a means to allocate political power among the various political subdivisions. The census you reference is based on information gathered by the Trump Administration, collected and memorialized by Trump, and due to the Covid pandemic, the incomplete public response to the actual 2020 Census.
I realize true believers can be very focused. The US Census is a wonderful source of information. But its function is political and subject to gaming. It's one source among many and shouldn't be given a status as an independent, unbiased perspective.
I dont want to argue aggainst your central point at all, but there is no country in europe under a socialist political system at the moment. The nordic countries are liberal democracies with a capitalistic market economy. Yes, there is high taxation, a strong welfare state and strong regulation of the market, but this is NOT socialism. There is private property, a free market and the "means of production" are not collectivized at all. You may call it social democracy or something along those lines, but saying that europe countries are socialist is just plain false. The nordic countries have some quite admirable policies and societal and economic outcomes but this is due to capitalism and a state that intervenes in the case of market failure and other undesirable side effects of market economy not due to socialism.
Sorry for triggered rambling, am german liberal democrat.
Half of Germany was socialist til '89, shit was not cash money at all.
Have a nice day from Frankfurt!
A German is probably better equipped to make these observations but for what it's worth, let me make a few observations. Anything less than predatory capitalism is considered socialism/communism in America. Single payer healthcare - commie! A living wage -commie! Proper public education - commie!
The OP commented communist nation were corrupt as if that were not the case in capitalist countries. My culture were communist or more properly - a community. They looked after their families and neighbors' well-being. It was not corrupt but born of the understanding that the suffering of one is felt by all. We were marched 1400 miles barefoot in winter by the US army when gold was discovered on our home by white settlers. Thousands died of disease, starvation, and exposure along the forced journey.
I have my own opinion of the models of governance around the world. America does not have the moral authority to dictate to other countries how to best serve the needs of their citizens.
Read the 2020 Census and learn how it was working out: https://www.census.gov/content...
"[In 2019,] the Black poverty rate was the lowest since 1959, the first year for which poverty estimates were published."
"The 2019 Hispanic poverty rate of 15.7 percent reflects the lowest poverty rate for this population since estimates were first produced in 1972."
The lowest poverty rates in 50 years? Time to "fix" that!
Ya...Primary sources can be a bitch.
Have someone explain to you the difference between coincidence and causality.
These were all established trends. None had a dammed thing to do with anything the bigoted, sphincter-lipped vulgarian did.
Seattle band. That statue is located in the Fremont neighborhood.
I probably could have shared that with Drifting Dave too; I'm just not that smart!
3526 Fremont Pl N, Seattle, WA 98103
Long Live RP and the Freedom to be Peculiar!
I had, I knew that it is an acronym of the band member's names but I suppose YOU should have had a look at the album cover where the band members pose before a statue of Lenin as well as the album name ''contra-intelligence''. @lizardking Wow, what a tone-deaf reply...
Seattle band. That statue is located in the Fremont neighborhood.
Read the 2020 Census and learn how it was working out: https://www.census.gov/content...
"[In 2019,] the Black poverty rate was the lowest since 1959, the first year for which poverty estimates were published."
"The 2019 Hispanic poverty rate of 15.7 percent reflects the lowest poverty rate for this population since estimates were first produced in 1972."
The lowest poverty rates in 50 years? Time to "fix" that!
Ya...Primary sources can be a bitch.
This is my contender for most primitive political online argument this year.
I dont want to argue aggainst your central point at all, but there is no country in europe under a socialist political system at the moment. The nordic countries are liberal democracies with a capitalistic market economy. Yes, there is high taxation, a strong welfare state and strong regulation of the market, but this is NOT socialism. There is private property, a free market and the "means of production" are not collectivized at all. You may call it social democracy or something along those lines, but saying that europe countries are socialist is just plain false. The nordic countries have some quite admirable policies and societal and economic outcomes but this is due to capitalism and a state that intervenes in the case of market failure and other undesirable side effects of market economy not due to socialism.
Sorry for triggered rambling, am german liberal democrat.
Half of Germany was socialist til '89, shit was not cash money at all.
Have a nice day from Frankfurt!
How's it working out?
Read the 2020 Census and learn how it was working out: https://www.census.gov/content...
"[In 2019,] the Black poverty rate was the lowest since 1959, the first year for which poverty estimates were published."
"The 2019 Hispanic poverty rate of 15.7 percent reflects the lowest poverty rate for this population since estimates were first produced in 1972."
The lowest poverty rates in 50 years? Time to "fix" that!
Ya...Primary sources can be a bitch.
It's literally their names. Julie King, Claude Ginsburg, Dave Bartley. Now putting them in that order... I guess maybe they thought they were being funny? I don't know.
How's it working out?
Aged like milk.
Why? Did your grey matter dissolve?
Gropey Joe and Willy's Hoe. Did yours?
DriftingDave wrote:
Look, the song is beautiful, no one can deny that; but to name a band after an organisation that was the spearhead for one of the most repressive state formations in modern history, with massively documented atrocities,already while this band was playing, shows that the band members must have been really stupid and ignorant, or in other words, effing commies. Before the re-haul of the RP website there used to be a picture (that someone uploaded to this thread) of a stroller with a dead baby inside tipped alongside other victims of communism, scattered on a frozen river bank somewhere in Russia. It seems to be gone now but ever since, this picture is what I get before my eyes every time I hear this song. So for me this song has become a homage to all the victims of the anti-human ideas of socialism/communism.
I've been reading a true story about an agent who defected from the KGB. Not in the least funny or witty or entertaining. It was a vicious terror organization.
Why? Did your grey matter dissolve?
Just came from cello concert with 4 of Vancouver's cellists playing classic Baroque pieces. Then to hear this. Rather special.
The KGB cannot take over the Kremlin again quick enough.
I suppose looking into the band might have shed light on the name and from where/when they came....
I had, I knew that it is an acronym of the band member's names but I suppose YOU should have had a look at the album cover where the band members pose before a statue of Lenin as well as the album name ''contra-intelligence''. @lizardking Wow, what a tone-deaf reply...
Very true. I'm hearing a little different story, but similar in mood. Living your life, making your experiences, failing at some important crossroad, getting up again, more experiences, things go well for a while, again failure and suffering, wondering what it's all about and how and what for it'll all end. And yes, death. Your own and that of dear ones. The ever-present question: can we somehow, in some way, survive death? Give it all a meaning?
How's it working out?
Do you have to ask that?
Look, the song is beautiful, no one can deny that; but to name a band after an organisation that was the spearhead for one of the most repressive state formations in modern history, with massively documented atrocities,already while this band was playing, shows that the band members must have been some really stupid and ignorant, or in other words, effing commies. Before the re-haul of the RP website there used to be a picture (that someone uploaded to this thread) of a stroller with a dead baby inside tipped alongside other victims of communism, scattered on a frozen river bank somewhere in Russia. It seems to be gone now but ever since, this picture is what I get before my eyes every time I hear this song. So for me this song has become a homage to all the victims of the anti-human ideas of socialism/communism.
I suppose looking into the band might have shed light on the name and from where/when they came....
https://www.kgbmole.com/kgb/
"This KGB is not a spy organization, but a band from Seattle
that plays for New England style contradance, English Country
Dance (as MI-5), Mostly Waltz and other social dance events, concerts, and private functions such as
wedding receptions. We write a lot of our own music, and the
rest comes from all over the world: the British Isles, French
Canada, the Northeastern USA, Western and Eastern Europe, South
America, the rest of the USA, and places we haven't yet identified.
Our waltz, Call It a Night, is featured on Radio Paradise; another waltz, The Clock Stopped, is used by Richard Powers to teach cross-step waltz.
We are:
Julie King - piano
Claude Ginsburg - violin, concertina, viola
Dave Bartley - mandolin, guitar, cittern, etc.
Look, the song is beautiful, no one can deny that; but to name a band after an organisation that was the spearhead for one of the most repressive state formations in modern history, with massively documented atrocities,already while this band was playing, shows that the band members must have been really stupid and ignorant, or in other words, effing commies. Before the re-haul of the RP website there used to be a picture (that someone uploaded to this thread) of a stroller with a dead baby inside tipped alongside other victims of communism, scattered on a frozen river bank somewhere in Russia. It seems to be gone now but ever since, this picture is what I get before my eyes every time I hear this song. So for me this song has become a homage to all the victims of the anti-human ideas of socialism/communism.
I feel like I've heard it every month or two on RP for years.
It's almost, but not quite enough.
Give me some music to steal theim my siprituality
Highlow
American Net'Zen
How's it working out?
what blows my mind is how do these people who are geniuses/prodigies make a living? who pays them enough to live on. we need to bring back times when there were rich patrons of the arts. what happened to that?
Rich patricians for the arts still exist, they're generally tax dodgers who live above the law and use tax havens, and pay to have wings in art galleries named after them so that the average joe thinks they're amazing. When all they had to do was stay anonymous and pay their friggin' taxes like ordinary people.
Exactly !
what blows my mind is how do these people who are geniuses/prodigies make a living? who pays them enough to live on. we need to bring back times when there were rich patrons of the arts. what happened to that?
Exactly !
Cool to remind me about that.
I had a game called Spy vs. Spy: The Island Caper on my MSX. As a 5-7 year old kid I never figured out how to play the game and what's the goal.
Simple, kill the other guy and call it self defense.
Some things never change, read the news.
Amazing how often I hear it. In 48 hours it gets played twice? Hit the random button, will ya Bill?
Julie King. Claude Ginsburg. Dave Bartley.
Highlow
American Net'Zen
Highlow
American Net'Zen
One of the agents last move was to distribute
Christian comics at the Madras railway station.
It's called Chennai now
One of the agents last move was to distribute
Christian comics at the Madras railway station.
Cool to remind me about that.
I had a game called Spy vs. Spy: The Island Caper on my MSX. As a 5-7 year old kid I never figured out how to play the game and what's the goal.
True, but it does come up a whole lot in rotation. Not that there's anything wrong with that!
Like I said. I find myself whistling the entirety of the song. Could be Talking Heads, so no complaints here!
Yeah less linear and parallel.
Thanks for advise on the album.
This tune is just magic.
This is one of my favorite songs played on RP and yet another example of one I never would have heard of any other way. I put it on my iPod, and it always has a calming effect.
True, but it does come up a whole lot in rotation. Not that there's anything wrong with that!
I do like this.......but I love your post as well!
Vodka
be-y
'Irony Curtainy'
would-y
it-y
?
to me the name is all wrong for the music, but then 'The Brand New Heavies' play jazz, so what do i know eh?
I have thought about this post a lot (the one to which you replied). The KGB was a murderous band of thugs, who changed their name from the NKVD which was a genocidal band of thugs. For Russians this name must be really hard to swallow. Of course it is meant with irony and perhaps the band is unaware of the significance. Let me ask you, what if a band named itself The Gestapo, or The SS, The Ku Klux Klan, or Khmer Rouge?
They need to change it, but am open to argument.
Perhaps the open joy in their music would indicate a certain irony in the name?
Light rather than heat. An unusual thing on RP comments. Thanks for the information and background.
Irony isn't entirely new in band names. New Order is clearly a reference to 30s fascism, and the band's previous name of Joy Division referred to Jewish sex slaves in concentration camps. If the irony of KGB is offensive, then imagine how much more offensive New Order's irony was in view of the Holocaust.
Actually, the band's manager read a newspaper article about the Cambodian government that followed the Khmer Rouge's reign of terror.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Order#Origins_and_formation:_1977.E2.80.931980
"Rob Gretton, the band's manager for over twenty years, is credited for having found the name "New Order" in an article in The Guardian entitled "The People's New Order of Kampuchea". "
The band freaked out when they learned about the Nazis' earlier use of the phrase:
https://www.bandnameexplained.com/2013/07/new-order-band-name-meaning.html
"After the members of New Order had found out that their band name had a rather charged meaning, they stated profusely that they distanced themselves from Hitler's ideas. Singer Bernard Sumner: 'We really, really thought it didn't have any connotations, and we thought that it was a neutral name, it didn't mean much.’ "
Hey, RDO : Communist revolution, not socialist. We have socialists here in Canada. They run several provinces.They attacks the peasantry with offer management and crop insurance. They even stockpile a Maple Syrup Strategic Reserve. The socialist revolution here also wages war on its citizens by providing universal state ran health care, subsidizing day care and universities and providig funding for the CBC public broadcaster. The current Conservative government party is not socialist, according to most people's opinion. They're fostering free expression by starving the CBC and save Canadians by caring about nothing but oil and building pipelines.
USSR = Union of Soviet Socialist Republics
Hey, RDO : Communist revolution, not socialist. We have socialists here in Canada. They run several provinces.They attacks the peasantry with offer management and crop insurance. They even stockpile a Maple Syrup Strategic Reserve. The socialist revolution here also wages war on its citizens by providing universal state ran health care, subsidizing day care and universities and providig funding for the CBC public broadcaster. The current Conservative government party is not socialist, according to most people's opinion. They're fostering free expression by starving the CBC and save Canadians by caring about nothing but oil and building pipelines.
They need to change it, but am open to argument.
Your history is a little wobbly (the NKVD and other agencies merged and separated numerous times until splitting to form the KGB and MVD in the '50s) but the band is fully aware of who the KGB are/were. I don't know their politics but I do know they're from Seattle, where they are a beloved part of the music and dance community.
The statue of Lenin in the background of the cover photo is also in Seattle. Back in the '90s when towns in eastern Europe were toppling statues of communist icons and selling them for scrap an English teacher bought one and shipped it home. When he died it was put on display in the Fremont neighborhood in Seattle. It's still there (and for sale if you're interested) and has become something of a local landmark. Seattle is a place where a statue of Lenin isn't necessarily ironic.
KGB (the band, that is) plays and writes a lot of eastern European-influenced music. their album names are all playing off cold war themes and their record label is called Mole Records, but I doubt they are endorsing the Russian KGB. More likely playing off the relaxation of tensions following the end of the cold war, when a band in Seattle (home of defense contractor Boeing, nearby a large Navy base on Puget Sound, and arguably one of the most likely missile targets in North America) could turn an object of fear into an object of irony.
If it really bothers anyone you can contact the band thru their website and let your displeasure be known. You probably wouldn't be the first to get your knickers twisted about their name. If your outrage isn't real outrage, just internet outrage, feel free to hit the PSD button and boycott the band.
You'll be missing some great music tho.
Light rather than heat. An unusual thing on RP comments. Thanks for the information and background.
Irony isn't entirely new in band names. New Order is clearly a reference to 30s fascism, and the band's previous name of Joy Division referred to Jewish sex slaves in concentration camps. If the irony of KGB is offensive, then imagine how much more offensive New Order's irony was in view of the Holocaust.
I agree...Call it a night.
Does this mean that YOUR given name is really paisleydancer66?
All potential political/social consequence aside, I find this piece to be quite beautiful!
They need to change it, but am open to argument.
Your history is a little wobbly (the NKVD and other agencies merged and separated numerous times until splitting to form the KGB and MVD in the '50s) but the band is fully aware of who the KGB are/were. I don't know their politics but I do know they're from Seattle, where they are a beloved part of the music and dance community.
The statue of Lenin in the background of the cover photo is also in Seattle. Back in the '90s when towns in eastern Europe were toppling statues of communist icons and selling them for scrap an English teacher bought one and shipped it home. When he died it was put on display in the Fremont neighborhood in Seattle. It's still there (and for sale if you're interested) and has become something of a local landmark. Seattle is a place where a statue of Lenin isn't necessarily ironic.
KGB (the band, that is) plays and writes a lot of eastern European-influenced music. their album names are all playing off cold war themes and their record label is called Mole Records, but I doubt they are endorsing the Russian KGB. More likely playing off the relaxation of tensions following the end of the cold war, when a band in Seattle (home of defense contractor Boeing, nearby a large Navy base on Puget Sound, and arguably one of the most likely missile targets in North America) could turn an object of fear into an object of irony.
If it really bothers anyone you can contact the band thru their website and let your displeasure be known. You probably wouldn't be the first to get your knickers twisted about their name. If your outrage isn't real outrage, just internet outrage, feel free to hit the PSD button and boycott the band.
You'll be missing some great music tho.
This is one of my favorite songs played on RP and yet another example of one I never would have heard of any other way. I put it on my iPod, and it always has a calming effect.
They need to change it, but am open to argument.
Your history is a little wobbly (the NKVD and other agencies merged and separated numerous times until splitting to form the KGB and MVD in the '50s) but the band is fully aware of who the KGB are/were. I don't know their politics but I do know they're from Seattle, where they are a beloved part of the music and dance community.
The statue of Lenin in the background of the cover photo is also in Seattle. Back in the '90s when towns in eastern Europe were toppling statues of communist icons and selling them for scrap an English teacher bought one and shipped it home. When he died it was put on display in the Fremont neighborhood in Seattle. It's still there (and for sale if you're interested) and has become something of a local landmark. Seattle is a place where a statue of Lenin isn't necessarily ironic.
KGB (the band, that is) plays and writes a lot of eastern European-influenced music. their album names are all playing off cold war themes and their record label is called Mole Records, but I doubt they are endorsing the Russian KGB. More likely playing off the relaxation of tensions following the end of the cold war, when a band in Seattle (home of defense contractor Boeing, nearby a large Navy base on Puget Sound, and arguably one of the most likely missile targets in North America) could turn an object of fear into an object of irony.
If it really bothers anyone you can contact the band thru their website and let your displeasure be known. You probably wouldn't be the first to get your knickers twisted about their name. If your outrage isn't real outrage, just internet outrage, feel free to hit the PSD button and boycott the band.
You'll be missing some great music tho.
um. the band got their name from combining the first initials of each of the founding member's last names: julie king, claude ginsburg, and dave bartley. please for the love of all that is holy, LIGHTEN. UP.
And yet the album art and title belie that neat explanation
What if the band had six members-- Nick, Ian, Greg, Ryan... you get the picture? I win
No?
OK then. Just thought that was kinda cool.
um. the band got their name from combining the first initials of each of the founding member's last names: julie king, claude ginsburg, and dave bartley. please for the love of all that is holy, LIGHTEN. UP.
Those band names aren't quite as direct in their associations and those associations are almost seventy years old. This band's name doesn't bother me, but I could see how it could bother people, especially people who may have been directly affected by the KGB, which still existed in the 1990s.
I have thought about this post a lot (the one to which you replied). The KGB was a murderous band of thugs, who changed their name from the NKVD which was a genocidal band of thugs. For Russians this name must be really hard to swallow. Of course it is meant with irony and perhaps the band is unaware of the significance. Let me ask you, what if a band named itself The Gestapo, or The SS, The Ku Klux Klan, or Khmer Rouge?
They need to change it, but am open to argument.
Do you apply the same thinking to Joy Division and New Order? There such a thing as the ironic use labels known for other reasons.
Those band names aren't quite as direct in their associations and those associations are over seventy years old. This band's name doesn't bother me, but I could see how it could bother other people, especially people who may have been directly affected by the KGB, which still existed in the 1990s.
Do you apply the same thinking to Joy Division and New Order? There such a thing as the ironic use labels known for other reasons.